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Discussing the origins of words and phrases, in English or any other language.

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Post #12806 2
Scouser from lobscouse, Kraut from sauerkraut, frogs… What are other demonyms derived from food?

In Dutch kaaskop (=cheese head) refers to Dutch people, especially from the North and South Holland provinces. In French rosbif is a slightly mocking reference to the English.

I'm curious about any words derived from food referring to people in states, regions, cities, etc.

https://redd.it/1wokabn
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Post #12804 2
What is the root/origin of Delhi/Dilli name?

Referring to India's capital. On wiki and newspaper article, I could gather multiple stories, however, none with actual proof. 1. King Dhillu or Dilu in 50 BCE

2. Dhili/Dhila (Loose in Prakrit and hindustani) pillar

3. Dil meaning eminence!!

History is proper from 1000 CE onwards of Tomar rule. However, before that everything is just hearsay. Mahabharat connection is most BS theory as none archeological evidence even suggest that! There is mention of Ashoka pillar in the area, but no mention of city name.

I am looking for this word's roots, origin from before of 1000 CE. Any mention in inscription, literature witty references will be helpful.

Also, there is no clarity on when the city was established. Exact time period and ruling clan, language influence will also help!

https://redd.it/1wo94r1
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Post #12803 3
Guard and Ward: the same Germanic root, split by a French dialect, then reunited in English.

Most doublets in English come from borrowing the same Latin word twice—royal/regal, sure/secure. But guard and ward are different. They split before either word reached English.

Both descend from Proto-Germanic *wardōną (“to watch, protect”). That root entered Frankish, then Old French. But Old French wasn’t uniform. The northern dialects (Picard, Norman) kept initial w-. The central Francien dialect shifted w- to gu-.

So English received two branches of the same word:

Northern warde → ward, warden, wardrobe
Central guarde → guard, guardian, regard

The OED confirms the split: ward is “inherited from Germanic,” while guard is “a borrowing from French”. Same root, different doors.

The result is two complete word families from one source. A warden and a guardian were historically the same job. You can guard a prisoner in a ward.

This is what I find most interesting about doublets: the redundancy of English isn’t just “too much borrowing.” It’s stratified. Each layer preserves a different dialect, a different century, a different path into the language.

Has anyone found other doublets where the split happened before the word entered English, rather than after?

https://redd.it/1wnz40d
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Post #12799 2
Melchiades and Miltiades

Thought the name "Melquíades" was cool and wanted to know the etymology. Every source I've found (which is nothing trustworthy: baby name sites, faith sites, AI) just says it's from Greek "Miltiades." It doesn't help that there was a pope known as both Miltiades and Melchiades.

I don't really buy it. For one, I don't see anything about a /t/ to /k/ sound change, in or between those languages. I think that Hebrew has some role here. My guesses are

I think, if it is Greek in origin, it is still borrowing "Melchi-" ("my king" or "king of") from Hebrew (compare "Melchizedek" and "Melchior").

Perhaps it's even a hellenization of "Melchi" by adding the patronymic suffix "-ades"?

Does that sound right? Any idea where I could find a source to support or refute those ideas?

https://redd.it/1wnscv5
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Post #12798 2
English isn’t a real language, it’s three drunk dialects in a trench coat trying to scam us with "aUtO-aNtOnYmS"

​

English is an absolute trainwreck of a dialect, and if you need proof that our ancestors were profoundly lazy, look no further than contronyms..... WORDS THAT LITERALLY ALSO EXIST AS THEIR OWN EXACT FUCKING OPPOSITES??..... And the most unfortunate part is that this ISN'T something you can even blame on MODERN INTERNET SLANG.... This is CENTURIES OF HISTORICAL INCOMPETENCE smashed into the EXACT same spellings.... fascinating, right?

Let's start by looking at the word "cleave."

It means to stick to something. Ya know, like superglue!

.....but it ALSO means to slice something cleanly in half with an axe.

Why? Because Old English had two distinct, perfectly fine words: clīfan (to stick) and clēofan (to split). BUT because English speakers have ALWAYS mumbled like they’re recovering from dental surgery, the pronunciations merged because everyone apparently just said fuck it so now the same word means BOTH joining a holy union AND decapitating someone??? Logic.

Then we have "sanction," which lets you either officially permit an action OR slap a country with economic ruin to starve their economy! It comes from the Latin word for a legal decree... but since legal scholars are apparently very incapable of writing NORMAL SENTENCES? Well, it seemed easier for them to just use the same word for the part of the law that grants a right and the part that punishes you for violating it, instead. Fast forward a few centuries, and "sanctioning" an idea means you either love it OR want to destroy it.... whatever floats your boat, i guess... right?

THIS IS TRULY GROUNDBREAKING STUFF HERE, GUYS....

But I'm not finished! Because the word "dust" is even DUMBER because English loves taking a noun and turning it into a verb without doing ANY actual work.... Its absolutely IMPRESSIVE how "dust" was just dirt until the 1500s, some BRILLIANT SCHOLAR decided "dusting" sounds better if it meant WIPING dirt off a shelf, instead!.... OH, BUT THAT'S NOT ALL! MEANWHILE, at the EXACT SAME TIME, a baker ALSO decided "dusting" should ACTUALLY mean dumping a cup of powdered sugar all over a damn pastry....

So JUST an update? We now have a single verb that means both adding and removing the exact same substance, because apparently context clues are supposed to do all the heavy lifting.

My PERSONAL favorite? HAS to be the ELITE LEVEL STUPID WORD known as "OVERLOOK." Why? Simple. Because if you stand on a high cliff and look over a valley, you’re SUPERVISING it like a MAJESTIC OVERSEER!

.....BUUUUUUT, if your STUPID eyes literally look over a detail on a page? Well, that means you just missed it ENTIRELY.

Around the 1600s, the "accidental neglect" meaning completely took over everyday speech. So now, if you "overlook" an issue at work, you either managed the project OR you're just dead ass about to get FIRED for missing a massive fuckin mistake??.....

I am CONVINCED of the fact of which that at LEAST HALF of our vocabulary exists SOLELY because our ancestors either couldn't pronounce vowels, sucked at writing laws or just forgot how fuckin line-of-sight works.

https://redd.it/1wnpgke
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Post #12797 2
PU (pee-yew) as in "that stinks"?

Found myself wondering about this phrase, which, circa my childhood in the '90s, was in common use where I lived in New England. This article seems to reasonably describe its etymology, but since I'm curious also about the extent and nature of its usage through the present day, anecdotally or otherwise, I thought I might ask around here. Thanks!

https://redd.it/1wnk6cy
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Mental Floss Why Do We Say “PU” When Something Stinks? Sadly, PU isn’t an initialism for “Pretty unsavory!”, “Putrid, ugh!”, or even “Please use (deodorant)!”
Post #12796 1
Guard and Ward: the same Germanic root, split by a French dialect, then reunited in English.

Most doublets in English come from borrowing the same Latin word twice—royal/regal, sure/secure. But guard and ward are different. They split before either word reached English.

Both descend from Proto-Germanic *wardōną (“to watch, protect”). That root entered Frankish, then Old French. But Old French wasn’t uniform. The northern dialects (Picard, Norman) kept initial w-. The central Francien dialect shifted w- to gu-.

So English received two branches of the same word:

Northern warde → ward, warden, wardrobe
Central guarde → guard, guardian, regard

The OED confirms the split: ward is “inherited from Germanic,” while guard is “a borrowing from French”. Same root, different doors.

The result is two complete word families from one source. A warden and a guardian were historically the same job. You can guard a prisoner in a ward.

This is what I find most interesting about doublets: the redundancy of English isn’t just “too much borrowing.” It’s stratified. Each layer preserves a different dialect, a different century, a different path into the language.

Has anyone found other doublets where the split happened before the word entered English, rather than after?

https://redd.it/1wmfm11
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Post #12794 2
The word 'cliche' is an onomatopoeia for 19th century industrial machinery

The word "cliché" is LITERALLY the sound that printing presses made in the 19th century. ​In France, printers turned common phrases into single, pre-made metal plates so they wouldn't have to spell them out letter-by-letter every time. Whenever they struck, it made a distinct "cliché" sound. Since those cast phrases were overused to save time, the sound of making them dead ass just adapted to become the word to describe overused ideas!

.....oh, and speaking of which? The translation of said process is "stereotype" lol

https://redd.it/1wn2h3v
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Post #12792 2
『🌸☀️SEASON🍁❄️』 in the major languages of the Sinosphere (China - Korea - Japan - Vietnam) and Mainland Southeast Asian Indosphere (Cambodia - Laos - Thailand - Myanmar)
https://redd.it/1wmx4jw
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